Episode 47 The Strategic Differentiators Branded Entertainment vs. Content Marketing vs. Traditional Advertising
English (US)
01:00:00.240 — 01:00:04.160 · Speaker 1
You can showcase your products in a real use case.
01:00:04.240 — 01:00:11.520 · Speaker 2
There’s a fine line between just a really long ad. Yeah, and Brandon Fenty.
01:00:12.040 — 01:00:22.120 · Speaker 1
Yeah, they’ve become number two all of a sudden. 1 to 1. Well, they just got a sense that they need to do something technical, something interesting. That’s what you call us.
01:00:25.160 — 01:00:28.120 · Speaker 3
Look at my product. Please buy it.
01:00:28.520 — 01:00:30.880 · Speaker 4
That is traditional advertising.
01:00:31.560 — 01:00:52.160 · Speaker 2
Different to. Here’s a wonderful story. Here’s something entertaining. Something that’ll actually interest you. Oh, and by the way, it’s brought to you by Halo Studios. That is branded content. And branded content is what we’re going to talk about today with Karl and Richard. How’s it guys. Welcome.
Okay.
01:00:52.200 — 01:00:52.880 · Speaker 5
Yeah. Hey.
01:00:53.240 — 01:00:54.600 · Speaker 2
Exciting topic.
01:00:54.880 — 01:00:56.120 · Speaker 5
Mhm. One of my favorite.
01:00:56.160 — 01:01:06.270 · Speaker 2
One of your favorites. Okay. So let’s start with you then Carl. um, there’s a fine line between just a really long ad.
01:01:06.950 — 01:01:07.230 · Speaker 5
Yeah.
01:01:07.270 — 01:01:08.910 · Speaker 2
And branded content.
01:01:08.950 — 01:01:09.470 · Speaker 5
Mhm.
01:01:09.750 — 01:01:11.470 · Speaker 2
How do you define the difference?
01:01:11.510 — 01:01:35.350 · Speaker 5
So actually I, I kind of split it into a few different things. Okay. So firstly we’ve got pure advertising right. Which is your 32nd TVC or TV advert commercial whatever it is. Right. Where. And you can do lots of things within that space. Then you’ve got sponsorship of content. Yeah. Where. Uh, well, the most popular one sports.
Right.
01:01:35.390 — 01:01:36.550 · Speaker 2
Brought to you by.
01:01:36.590 — 01:01:42.310 · Speaker 5
Slap on a logo on something that’s already got eyeballs. Sponsorship.
01:01:42.350 — 01:01:42.950 · Speaker 2
Okay.
01:01:43.510 — 01:01:51.870 · Speaker 5
And you have the brought to you buyers and all that, right? Then you’ve got branded entertainment, which has very little to do with your brand.
01:01:52.270 — 01:01:52.670 · Speaker 2
Okay.
01:01:52.710 — 01:02:16.420 · Speaker 5
But everything to do with your consumer, your targeted consumer and the consumer behavior. Okay. So. So branded entertainment is not necessarily got anything to do with your product or your or your physical logo, but rather creating a benefit for your consumers that drive them to your product or your brand.
01:02:16.580 — 01:02:23.979 · Speaker 6
An example I had with branding entertainment is if you take the brand out, it’s still entertaining and it’s still the
01:02:25.220 — 01:02:26.780 · Speaker 6
the video, the ad or whatever.
01:02:26.780 — 01:02:28.340 · Speaker 7
Is its value by itself.
01:02:28.340 — 01:02:30.900 · Speaker 6
Is still there. It’s not built around the brand.
01:02:31.260 — 01:02:38.820 · Speaker 2
And if you take the brand out of it, you might not know who created the content and that would still be fine.
01:02:38.860 — 01:02:39.180 · Speaker 5
Yeah.
01:02:39.220 — 01:02:39.940 · Speaker 7
And is that.
01:02:39.980 — 01:02:43.100 · Speaker 2
Is that safe? I mean, I could feel marketing managers.
01:02:43.140 — 01:02:44.620 · Speaker 6
Well, I think it’s tweeting.
01:02:44.620 — 01:02:45.220 · Speaker 7
Just the.
01:02:45.220 — 01:02:45.500 · Speaker 2
Thought.
01:02:45.500 — 01:02:45.780 · Speaker 7
Of that.
01:02:45.820 — 01:02:47.580 · Speaker 5
That’s again the whole point.
01:02:47.660 — 01:02:48.140 · Speaker 7
Okay.
01:02:48.180 — 01:02:52.020 · Speaker 5
Create content that reinforces your behavior.
01:02:52.100 — 01:02:52.660 · Speaker 2
Okay.
01:02:52.820 — 01:02:59.420 · Speaker 5
Right. So if you took the brand out of it, which most very good branded content doesn’t have a brand in it.
01:02:59.460 — 01:02:59.980 · Speaker 2
Mhm.
01:03:00.580 — 01:03:04.340 · Speaker 5
Um, the consumer is still going to watch it and be inspired to do.
01:03:04.500 — 01:03:05.940 · Speaker 2
Some kind of activity.
01:03:05.940 — 01:03:06.820 · Speaker 5
That drives them to your.
01:03:06.820 — 01:03:10.060 · Speaker 2
Brand. Okay. So back to your example Yeti.
01:03:10.220 — 01:03:18.820 · Speaker 5
Really good example. Uh, Chipotle in the u, u s did a very funny comedy show that. What is that?
01:03:19.900 — 01:03:20.780 · Speaker 2
What is it?
01:03:21.020 — 01:03:21.700 · Speaker 5
That’s.
01:03:21.820 — 01:03:22.900 · Speaker 2
Is it a takeaway?
01:03:23.140 — 01:03:25.380 · Speaker 5
It’s supposedly. Yeah, it’s a fast food chain.
01:03:25.420 — 01:03:26.180 · Speaker 2
Oh, okay.
01:03:26.460 — 01:03:43.140 · Speaker 5
Um, they made a drama about cows exploding because of all the hormones being pumped into it. So they reinforced the behavior of go buy good meat, which everybody knows Chipotle for. Okay, um, Yeti does the adventure documentaries.
01:03:43.900 — 01:03:45.140 · Speaker 2
And you don’t even see the products.
01:03:45.180 — 01:03:54.930 · Speaker 5
You don’t even see the products. Yeah, but what are they doing? Inspiring people to do adventure and get outside. And what are they going to do when they need to go outside for three weeks? They’re going to go buy Yeti.
01:03:54.970 — 01:03:56.370 · Speaker 2
Buy some Yeti products.
01:03:56.410 — 01:04:14.690 · Speaker 5
So is it for every brand? No. As you can see, you need a bit of brand presence already for this to really be effective. Okay. But why is it effective? It’s it’s because people are ad adverse. They don’t want to watch ads. Yeah.
01:04:14.890 — 01:04:24.530 · Speaker 2
So so just on that point, is that one of the things that differentiates it from an ad? It’s the length of it. It’s a no long format. Oh.
01:04:24.810 — 01:04:29.810 · Speaker 5
It doesn’t have to be long format. Okay. Um, what it needs to be is not an advert.
01:04:29.810 — 01:04:31.690 · Speaker 2
It needs to be entertainment, telling something.
01:04:31.690 — 01:04:33.370 · Speaker 6
It’s entertainment or holding a product.
01:04:33.370 — 01:04:34.530 · Speaker 5
It’s entertainment first.
01:04:35.010 — 01:05:00.640 · Speaker 6
Like some local examples might be standard Bank running a show about an entrepreneur starting a business and their bank with standard Bank or, um, checkers 6060 having a cooking show where all the ingredients are from 6060 or something like so if the ingredients came from somewhere else. The show is still the same, but in this case it’s 6060, so it’s reinforcing their behavior.
01:05:00.680 — 01:05:24.400 · Speaker 5
And it’s not a new concept. I think people like Red bull. Brands like Red bull say yes, perfected it in a sense. They they do more branded entertainment than they do advertising. If you think about how they support extreme sports, yes. And they create all this entertainment around because extreme fringe sports that we’ve never seen before.
01:05:24.560 — 01:05:26.120 · Speaker 2
Like soapbox racing.
01:05:26.120 — 01:05:34.640 · Speaker 5
And then obviously the fringe sports like the soapbox racing and the fun stuff and whatever massive viewership. And we can just thank Red bull for that.
01:05:34.680 — 01:05:37.840 · Speaker 2
But Red bull’s logo is all over that.
01:05:38.120 — 01:05:49.520 · Speaker 5
Yes, it was, but it was a sport at sports. So you kind of used to seeing the logo in and everything, right. And there’s other sponsors in those sports too.
01:05:49.800 — 01:05:55.990 · Speaker 6
Well again take Red bull out. People are still watching the the ridiculous race or whatever the case may be.
01:05:56.030 — 01:06:35.630 · Speaker 2
So it’s not necessarily whether or not the logo is placed or the product is placed. It’s more about the content piece itself. Yes. Okay. All right. Okay. How do you balance. Now let’s say we’re going to go and talk to a brand about creating some entertaining content. Their desire is to put their product in front of people or talk about their service.
How do you balance the desire from the brand side to be very present with the audience’s desire to see as little of that, and have it much more subtle?
01:06:36.430 — 01:07:06.670 · Speaker 5
So it’s a it’s a conversation and a collaboration with the brand first and foremost. And that’s what separates branded content from sponsorship stuff, is that you get involved really early on with the brand because the content revolves around them. Yeah, and to create an authentic story that’s in line with the brand story is really important.
So taking an existing idea to a brand and trying to make them merge isn’t a great idea.
01:07:06.710 — 01:07:07.390 · Speaker 2
Okay.
01:07:07.430 — 01:07:31.990 · Speaker 5
Rather, we want to do something with the brand or the brand wants to do something. So let’s develop something that’s totally natural fit for them. Right. And then you won’t have massive problems. That’s the that’s my approach as well. If somebody wants to get involved with something, let’s start it from scratch with them.
Mhm. Um I would say potentially.
01:07:32.030 — 01:07:38.190 · Speaker 2
They need to have bought into the concept of branded content or branded entertainment before that meeting.
01:07:38.230 — 01:08:23.500 · Speaker 5
Well that’s the tough part because not all brands are thinking this way even though it can benefit them. Mhm. Um so sometimes what we would do for example, is try to be proactive. If we’ve got a great storyline and we know it’s a really good match for our brand. We’ll approach them early on and say, hey, we’ve got this idea, we really think it can work for you.
We had a show a few years ago that we were talking to the brand, and we knew their problems and we knew what they wanted to achieve, and we didn’t have an answer for them. And then I was at a TV conference overseas, and I spoke to someone else, and I went, you know what? That story and this brand is made in heaven.
01:08:24.260 — 01:08:24.580 · Speaker 2
Yeah.
01:08:24.620 — 01:08:26.340 · Speaker 5
And that’s how that one came about.
01:08:26.380 — 01:08:27.020 · Speaker 2
Right.
01:08:27.100 — 01:08:28.180 · Speaker 8
And we did an AFP.
01:08:28.220 — 01:08:28.940 · Speaker 9
Here locally.
01:08:28.940 — 01:08:31.100 · Speaker 5
And everybody was involved. It was great.
01:08:31.180 — 01:08:33.340 · Speaker 2
Tell everyone what an AFP is.
01:08:33.380 — 01:08:36.340 · Speaker 1
Okay, so that’s an ad funded show.
01:08:36.419 — 01:08:37.020 · Speaker 2
Okay.
01:08:37.099 — 01:08:56.770 · Speaker 5
Um, so that can be brand entertainment. It could be a sponsored show, but it just means it’s been funded by an advertiser. So a broad cluster hasn’t commissioned it? Yes. The advertiser and the production company have, um, created the content on a finding the content and giving it.
01:08:56.890 — 01:08:59.170 · Speaker 2
So surely that’s branded entertainment right there.
01:08:59.210 — 01:09:01.690 · Speaker 8
Yeah. And it’s, it’s overall nutshell.
01:09:01.850 — 01:09:04.290 · Speaker 5
How it’s executed can be.
01:09:04.330 — 01:09:04.610 · Speaker 2
Can be.
01:09:04.610 — 01:09:05.730 · Speaker 5
Different. Different. Yeah.
01:09:05.770 — 01:09:06.130 · Speaker 2
Okay.
01:09:06.290 — 01:09:24.170 · Speaker 6
That’s quite cool because because of the nature of branded content, you can have the the concept for a show and then sell it to a brand. Obviously it’s nice of the brand. Yes, it’s the narrative, but if one brand sort of pulls out, you could essentially sell it to another one because it’s more about the entertainment.
Mhm.
01:09:24.690 — 01:09:49.400 · Speaker 5
Yes. But the, the brand subjects are so different. Yeah. So if I’m trying to create a brand behavior or a consumer behavior around my brand, it might not look the same for my competitor. Yeah. Um but there’s exceptions to that. For example, uh, let’s take MasterChef. Australia was probably the best thing to ever happen to a culinary school in Australia.
01:09:50.000 — 01:09:51.800 · Speaker 2
But it wasn’t brought about by culinary.
01:09:51.840 — 01:09:52.360 · Speaker 1
It wasn’t brought.
01:09:52.360 — 01:09:57.080 · Speaker 5
In by the school, but it’s probably the best example of if I was a brand.
01:09:57.640 — 01:09:58.920 · Speaker 2
Yes, it’s driving behavior.
01:09:58.960 — 01:10:45.680 · Speaker 5
It’s driving behavior, right? Yeah. And it had nothing to do with culinary schools. But look at the stats of how that accelerated that industry in Australia. Yes. And you see the power of it. Yeah. Um, so that’s what we call a category job, right? So you’re advertising into category? Yes. So banking often struggles with this.
So you would need a brand presence in a banking brand and sandwich shop. Otherwise let’s let’s be real. If you remove the bank’s logo, all banks do the same thing. Mhm. And that’s also a problem. If a bank wants to be really clever, they would find their USP and create entertainment around people that need that USP of value that USP.
Yeah, yeah. Unique selling point. Yes.
01:10:45.760 — 01:10:46.560 · Speaker 2
Thank you.
01:10:47.520 — 01:10:48.320 · Speaker 1
So you were going to ask?
01:10:48.360 — 01:11:11.040 · Speaker 2
We all have these acronyms, but you know, not not all of our listeners use them every day. Okay. How would our approach change? Let’s say we are talking to a brand. They’re excited about the concept of branded entertainment. How would our approach change based on different formats. So for example, if we’re going to put together something for.
01:11:11.120 — 01:11:11.680 · Speaker 4
Traditional.
01:11:11.680 — 01:11:23.600 · Speaker 2
Television versus something for YouTube, where it maybe is slightly longer format or TikTok with really short,
01:11:24.960 — 01:11:32.680 · Speaker 2
potentially viral content. How would our approach change to that entertainment piece based on those different formats?
01:11:33.440 — 01:11:37.160 · Speaker 5
Um, a very a lot.
01:11:38.680 — 01:11:39.880 · Speaker 2
So let’s unpack.
01:11:39.880 — 01:11:40.840 · Speaker 6
It. It’d be budget.
01:11:41.160 — 01:11:42.030 · Speaker 2
Budget. Okay.
01:11:42.230 — 01:11:42.670 · Speaker 1
Yeah.
01:11:42.710 — 01:11:46.270 · Speaker 5
So the approach to it is again, what is the brand want to achieve?
01:11:46.310 — 01:11:47.190 · Speaker 2
Yes. And who are they?
01:11:47.350 — 01:12:00.790 · Speaker 5
Who are the brand and what are their targets? So I mean, think about Lego with the Lego movies. That’s branded entertainment, right? And very successfully so. Even had the product in it. But you don’t feel like the products in a dull time, right?
01:12:00.830 — 01:12:01.150 · Speaker 6
Yeah.
01:12:01.190 — 01:12:03.910 · Speaker 5
Yeah. But that’s a feature film process, right?
01:12:03.950 — 01:12:06.070 · Speaker 2
I didn’t even have feature film on my list.
01:12:06.110 — 01:12:14.470 · Speaker 5
Yeah. You didn’t. Yeah. Terrible. Mhm. Um, TikTok branded entertainment could be very close to advertising.
01:12:14.830 — 01:12:16.030 · Speaker 2
It could be macro drama.
01:12:16.070 — 01:12:40.660 · Speaker 6
Well, so there’s a bit of a shift between like. Yeah, people trying to go viral now. Mhm. There’s more of like a community focus now. So those like micro dramas are a really good way to do it. Um and with TikTok and stuff like that it’s actually quite affordable to do it on those platforms. Um, so yeah, I guess it just depends.
01:12:40.700 — 01:12:42.300 · Speaker 2
A lot of it is down to budgets.
01:12:42.340 — 01:12:45.300 · Speaker 6
Down to budget and and need brief and.
01:12:45.460 — 01:13:39.890 · Speaker 5
And objective and scope. And how does it fit into the overall strategy? Um, there’s a lot of a lot of things to consider, right. I think if if a brand is finding themselves in a place where they feel like they aren’t breaking through in an area or they’re not, their advertising has become stagnant. Um, the brand is losing, uh, towards one of their competitors.
You know, they’ve become number two all of a sudden. Not number one. Yeah. Or they just got a sense that they need to do something tactical, something interesting. That’s when you call us and we go, well, this is the objective we have. This is the audience we want to attract. This is the new product we’re launching, whatever it is.
Yeah. How do we make this big?
01:13:40.050 — 01:13:40.530 · Speaker 2
Yeah.
01:13:40.650 — 01:13:50.210 · Speaker 5
How do we popularize the use of this product and ensure that audiences are driven to our product and not the competitor?
01:13:50.250 — 01:14:56.480 · Speaker 2
I think it can also be quite interesting if you’re looking to reinvigorate a an audience that’s maybe gone quiet for you as a brand or if you want to move into a new audience. You know, we’ve we’ve seen clients who have identified that their customer base is getting old and they’re moving off kind of the traditional.
They’re not as easily as accessible as they used to be. And they’re looking for younger audiences. And so they’re choosing platforms which would typically not really have been their go to. And, you know, for for us in our country, if we’re looking to reach a larger audience digitally and more youthful audience, TikTok is such a great way to go.
And so you might maybe take something new, like an entertainment content piece, also onto a new platform? Yes. So, you know, you can actually trial something in a space where you haven’t already been. Um, and, and, uh, address two issues. Sure. Um, a trial of a content type and a trial of a platform.
01:14:56.520 — 01:15:18.960 · Speaker 5
Yeah, but it’s it’s identifying gaps in your marketing mix, right? So take visa, Mastercard, one of those two. Um, they’re always struggling to get younger people to use cards. Right. Okay, so let’s create a show with Zac Efron going around the world looking at alternative ways to live. And everywhere he goes, he taps his car card.
01:15:20.080 — 01:15:21.080 · Speaker 5
Job done.
01:15:21.120 — 01:15:23.280 · Speaker 1
Yeah. Incidental.
01:15:24.080 — 01:15:34.920 · Speaker 5
Um, attracted the right audience. Yes. Move the bottom line. And people went, oh, if we just had a visa or whatever it was, yes, I could show the world and just tap wherever I was. Problem solved.
01:15:34.960 — 01:15:43.400 · Speaker 6
Yeah. Two could be like Zac Efron. You could. Do you have to disclose that piece of content is branded.
01:15:45.280 — 01:15:54.720 · Speaker 5
Not on a broadcaster. Depends on YouTube. There is definitely community rules about brand funded things. You have to declare it.
01:15:56.160 — 01:15:58.880 · Speaker 5
Um, but on broadcasting, the streamers know
01:16:00.000 — 01:16:08.640 · Speaker 5
that as far as I know. It’s the same as when you go to the cinema and you watch James Bond, which is probably the most commercially funded film I’ve ever seen.
01:16:08.680 — 01:16:10.600 · Speaker 6
He’s done a lot for vodka martinis.
01:16:11.200 — 01:16:13.040 · Speaker 5
He has, and a lot will end.
01:16:13.120 — 01:16:14.520 · Speaker 2
I don’t know if it’s vodka, though.
01:16:14.760 — 01:16:15.600 · Speaker 6
He has vodka.
01:16:15.800 — 01:16:17.280 · Speaker 2
Oh, does he have vodka martini?
01:16:17.320 — 01:16:18.120 · Speaker 5
And he shakes it, and.
01:16:18.680 — 01:16:23.640 · Speaker 2
I know he shakes it, which is outrageous, but I wasn’t sure it was vodka.
01:16:23.960 — 01:17:01.750 · Speaker 5
Yeah. So that product placement is done all the time. Okay, it’s not branded entertainment, but it’s product placement. Yeah, but you don’t have to declare it. Yeah, it’s it’s part of the world. It’s real life. It’s. Yeah. And that’s what’s so great about entertainment. Yes. And branded entertainment is.
You can showcase your products in a real use case. Yes. Yes. It doesn’t have to be polished and sitting perfectly. All you need to do is get someone’s hero to go whip out his Swiss army knife and save the world. Yeah. Um. Which is a real use case.
01:17:02.270 — 01:17:03.110 · Speaker 6
Saving the world.
01:17:03.110 — 01:17:04.670 · Speaker 10
With, um. You know, it’s happening all the time.
01:17:04.790 — 01:17:05.589 · Speaker 5
Happening all the time.
01:17:05.709 — 01:17:07.230 · Speaker 6
So next time I had a friend.
01:17:07.350 — 01:17:16.550 · Speaker 5
Next time I walked past the shop and I go, you know what, MacGyver? My frickin hero has a knife exactly like that. I also want one.
01:17:16.589 — 01:17:30.110 · Speaker 2
Yeah. Yeah. Okay. What do we do when, uh, a client wants to talk about their brand and really bring through the story of their brand?
01:17:30.190 — 01:17:40.660 · Speaker 5
See, that’s a good objective, right? We’ve got a clear objective that we want to talk about what our service or brand can do for you? Yes. What about our podcast?
01:17:40.700 — 01:17:41.460 · Speaker 2
Right.
01:17:41.500 — 01:17:42.060 · Speaker 5
What about.
01:17:42.100 — 01:17:44.180 · Speaker 6
Okay. That’s just not branded content then.
01:17:44.220 — 01:17:46.340 · Speaker 2
Yeah. No, but it is.
01:17:46.380 — 01:17:47.100 · Speaker 5
It is.
01:17:49.140 — 01:17:50.540 · Speaker 2
It is. I mean, it stands.
01:17:50.820 — 01:17:52.260 · Speaker 6
It is about the brand.
01:17:52.500 — 01:17:53.260 · Speaker 2
No. But if.
01:17:53.300 — 01:17:54.020 · Speaker 10
Well, okay.
01:17:54.180 — 01:17:55.660 · Speaker 5
That’s the thing about the brand.
01:17:55.660 — 01:18:03.220 · Speaker 2
But the podcast itself couldn’t be about the brand. The podcast would need to be about something else, but it’s talking about.
01:18:03.300 — 01:18:12.339 · Speaker 5
So. So let’s take again. I’ll just use banks for an example. Um, they want to talk about financial literacy or
01:18:13.820 — 01:18:20.380 · Speaker 5
educate young people about loans or buying a house or any of that. So they could do an educational piece.
01:18:20.420 — 01:18:20.900 · Speaker 6
Yeah. Yeah.
01:18:21.140 — 01:18:24.460 · Speaker 5
And then explain their products within that context.
01:18:24.500 — 01:18:32.689 · Speaker 2
So every brand has a story they want to tell their story. Not every brand’s story is going to be engaging or
01:18:33.930 — 01:18:35.050 · Speaker 2
is going to
01:18:36.250 — 01:18:40.250 · Speaker 2
be worthwhile as an entertainment piece. So what do we do in that case?
01:18:40.770 — 01:18:48.650 · Speaker 5
Well, I disagree, I think I could find anything entertaining. To be honest, every brand’s story is important.
01:18:48.690 — 01:18:53.570 · Speaker 2
I agree, but I think it might not all be entertaining. How do we get to the little gold nugget?
01:18:53.810 — 01:19:07.530 · Speaker 6
I guess I guess, I mean, I can’t think of too many examples now, but I guess every brand serves a purpose in people’s lives. Otherwise, what is it for? And there will be some kind of story or entertainment value around that.
01:19:07.890 — 01:19:21.250 · Speaker 5
Yeah, I think if you can’t tell an entertaining story, then you’ve got a problem. Um, I’ll give you an example. We were tasked with something similar for a very boring financial services business.
01:19:21.370 — 01:19:22.050 · Speaker 10
Okay.
01:19:22.290 — 01:19:25.170 · Speaker 5
But the business has been around for 150 years.
01:19:25.930 — 01:19:26.410 · Speaker 2
Yeah.
01:19:26.450 — 01:19:28.250 · Speaker 5
So, like, that is interesting.
01:19:28.250 — 01:19:28.930 · Speaker 10
Yeah.
01:19:28.970 — 01:19:38.610 · Speaker 5
So let’s tell the story of South Africa through the lens of financial services and what they’ve been through. And we created a documentary piece for them.
01:19:38.650 — 01:19:38.970 · Speaker 10
Okay.
01:19:39.010 — 01:19:40.530 · Speaker 5
It was fantastic. Yeah.
01:19:40.570 — 01:19:44.730 · Speaker 6
Ma brand sells water cream. How would we make a.
01:19:44.930 — 01:19:50.050 · Speaker 5
Okay, great. What cream? Where do warts come from? Frogs. All sorts of stuff.
01:19:50.090 — 01:19:51.770 · Speaker 6
I think that’s scientifically accurate.
01:19:51.810 — 01:19:52.610 · Speaker 10
I could make a.
01:19:52.610 — 01:20:00.930 · Speaker 5
Whole fantasy animation around that story and how it how the word cream magically makes water cream go away.
01:20:00.970 — 01:20:02.090 · Speaker 2
What’s going.
01:20:02.370 — 01:20:03.050 · Speaker 10
Oh, yeah. That one.
01:20:03.090 — 01:20:03.490 · Speaker 2
That one.
01:20:03.490 — 01:20:03.970 · Speaker 10
Now.
01:20:04.210 — 01:20:04.890 · Speaker 2
Well, there you go.
01:20:04.930 — 01:20:05.810 · Speaker 10
Okay. Well, that.
01:20:05.810 — 01:20:06.930 · Speaker 2
Point was moot.
01:20:07.050 — 01:20:07.450 · Speaker 10
Yeah.
01:20:09.330 — 01:20:10.090 · Speaker 5
I honestly.
01:20:10.130 — 01:20:10.690 · Speaker 10
Think.
01:20:11.690 — 01:20:15.010 · Speaker 5
Um, there is no boring stories when people are involved.
01:20:15.050 — 01:20:30.320 · Speaker 2
Yes. And also every every business has a journey like they’ve they’ve walked a path and but I think what’s interesting here is actually it’s you’ve got to tell that story without telling that story.
01:20:31.400 — 01:20:42.960 · Speaker 2
So what you’ve just described about telling. Talking about a documentary about South African history and, um, the financial sector through our history.
01:20:43.000 — 01:20:44.600 · Speaker 5
Oh, it’s a little bit. It’s not on the notes.
01:20:44.640 — 01:20:51.200 · Speaker 2
Exactly. That’s what I’m saying. So you’ve got to tell the story, but you’re telling that story about telling a different story that is entertaining.
01:20:51.240 — 01:21:00.160 · Speaker 5
Yeah, but that’s what stories are. If you want to warn your children not to wander out in the woods by themselves, you tell them. Hansel and Gretel.
01:21:00.200 — 01:21:00.920 · Speaker 10
Right.
01:21:01.240 — 01:21:02.160 · Speaker 5
That storyteller.
01:21:02.200 — 01:21:05.880 · Speaker 6
Yes. It’s actually so many. Yeah. Um, what’s the name? Little Red.
01:21:06.480 — 01:21:07.560 · Speaker 10
Riding Hood? Yeah. So?
01:21:07.600 — 01:21:15.840 · Speaker 5
So the basis of storytelling is exactly what you’re describing is we don’t learn from being told.
01:21:15.880 — 01:21:16.320 · Speaker 10
Mhm.
01:21:16.560 — 01:21:21.600 · Speaker 5
We learn from experience. And we can experience other people’s experiences.
01:21:21.600 — 01:21:21.960 · Speaker 10
Through.
01:21:22.000 — 01:21:22.360 · Speaker 2
Stories.
01:21:22.400 — 01:21:23.720 · Speaker 5
Through stories and film.
01:21:23.760 — 01:21:24.400 · Speaker 10
Yeah.
01:21:24.480 — 01:21:35.990 · Speaker 5
Um, people often ask me, why are horror stories the only thing that’s saving cinema right now? And I go, well, a really good horror is only really good on a big screen.
01:21:36.030 — 01:21:36.390 · Speaker 10
Okay.
01:21:36.430 — 01:21:49.470 · Speaker 5
And people love horror stories because there’s some lots of mental things happening in your brain at that time, and it releases lots of different chemicals into your brain and hormones and all sorts of things. And it’s very cathartic.
01:21:49.870 — 01:21:50.550 · Speaker 10
And it’s very safe.
01:21:51.110 — 01:21:52.110 · Speaker 6
I’m the biggest genre.
01:21:52.150 — 01:21:52.790 · Speaker 2
I cannot watch.
01:21:53.230 — 01:21:55.070 · Speaker 5
It’s the genre that’s saving film at the moment.
01:21:55.110 — 01:21:55.990 · Speaker 2
Oh, wow. That is.
01:21:55.990 — 01:21:56.430 · Speaker 10
Interesting.
01:21:56.430 — 01:22:07.950 · Speaker 5
Why? That’s hence why we have so many horrors coming out at the moment. So feature film, um, and horror, you can’t separate I mean, sinners, the Oscar nominated.
01:22:07.950 — 01:22:08.270 · Speaker 10
Film.
01:22:08.630 — 01:22:12.470 · Speaker 5
Horror. Okay, so, so but it comes down.
01:22:12.470 — 01:22:13.790 · Speaker 6
To I think.
01:22:14.110 — 01:22:14.510 · Speaker 10
So.
01:22:15.110 — 01:22:30.180 · Speaker 5
So again, the, um, the psychology of storytelling is we’re going to tell a child or a person a story. So they learn X, right? So why not learn to use your products.
01:22:30.220 — 01:22:30.660 · Speaker 10
Mm.
01:22:30.820 — 01:22:36.900 · Speaker 5
And it’s not telling someone to use your product. It’s convincing them. And it’s persuasion.
01:22:36.940 — 01:22:37.380 · Speaker 10
Yeah.
01:22:37.420 — 01:22:41.740 · Speaker 5
And isn’t that a much better way to get your brand message across?
01:22:42.020 — 01:22:47.820 · Speaker 2
Absolutely. Um, let’s talk about how podcasts might fit into this scenario.
01:22:47.860 — 01:22:48.460 · Speaker 10
Okay,
01:22:49.660 — 01:22:50.180 · Speaker 10
good.
01:22:51.220 — 01:22:51.540 · Speaker 10
Okay.
01:22:52.020 — 01:22:52.300 · Speaker 2
I mean.
01:22:52.300 — 01:22:52.700 · Speaker 10
You.
01:22:54.020 — 01:22:54.340 · Speaker 10
Yeah.
01:22:54.340 — 01:22:55.660 · Speaker 5
So obviously.
01:22:56.420 — 01:22:56.740 · Speaker 10
I.
01:22:58.300 — 01:23:03.740 · Speaker 5
Wanted to separate something that podcasts and a TV talk show are not the same thing.
01:23:03.820 — 01:23:04.460 · Speaker 10
Right.
01:23:04.500 — 01:23:07.940 · Speaker 5
And we’ve been doing talk shows since the beginning of.
01:23:07.980 — 01:23:09.140 · Speaker 10
Um, TV.
01:23:09.140 — 01:23:10.020 · Speaker 5
Pictures. Right.
01:23:10.060 — 01:23:10.540 · Speaker 10
Mhm.
01:23:10.580 — 01:23:12.740 · Speaker 5
It is highly entertaining.
01:23:12.900 — 01:23:13.340 · Speaker 10
Mhm.
01:23:13.660 — 01:23:15.740 · Speaker 5
Talk talk is highly entertaining.
01:23:15.860 — 01:23:16.460 · Speaker 10
Right.
01:23:16.500 — 01:23:42.980 · Speaker 5
Right. Especially if you’re watching Rich and Janet argue about something especially. So why wouldn’t you use that form? The benefit behind talk is it’s relatively cheap to do, right? You can get very authentic conversations going, which we all know our audiences want these days. They want the real story.
Yeah, they want the the inside story. Yes. They want to hear from the actual person.
01:23:43.020 — 01:23:43.380 · Speaker 10
Yeah.
01:23:44.060 — 01:24:22.930 · Speaker 5
Talk allows us to do that podcast. Allow us to do that. And what I’m loving about this new sort of evolution of talk is how creative we can now be, and how interesting the combinations of personalities can be in a room. And I’ve been watching this new podcast, which I mentioned the name of now, but they totally flipped the podcast on their heads and they’ve it’s funny, but because of the way they’ve done it, they’re getting these really interesting conversations about what’s going on in celebrities brains.
From the celebrity.
01:24:23.170 — 01:24:27.250 · Speaker 2
That you maybe wouldn’t ordinarily get if they were sitting formally on a couch.
01:24:27.290 — 01:24:27.570 · Speaker 10
Yeah.
01:24:27.610 — 01:24:28.730 · Speaker 5
Check out the Today.
01:24:28.730 — 01:24:30.650 · Speaker 10
Show or the normal talk show. Yeah.
01:24:30.690 — 01:24:31.890 · Speaker 5
Or with Oprah?
01:24:31.930 — 01:24:32.370 · Speaker 10
Yeah.
01:24:32.410 — 01:24:37.610 · Speaker 5
Um, okay. Oprah did amazing interviews, but there’s a new generation coming.
01:24:37.610 — 01:24:38.130 · Speaker 10
Out.
01:24:38.490 — 01:24:45.210 · Speaker 5
Of interesting, funny, entertaining. Graham Norton’s podcast. If you have not watched that.
01:24:45.250 — 01:24:47.050 · Speaker 2
Oh, I’m adding that to my list.
01:24:47.850 — 01:24:50.450 · Speaker 6
Uh, podcast show or.
01:24:50.450 — 01:24:51.689 · Speaker 10
Show talk, whatever it
01:24:52.730 — 01:24:53.450 · Speaker 10
is. Oh, okay.
01:24:53.610 — 01:24:54.850 · Speaker 5
Well, not his TV show.
01:24:54.890 — 01:24:58.410 · Speaker 10
Yes. His podcast. Digital show. Oh, okay. So it looks.
01:24:58.410 — 01:24:59.690 · Speaker 5
Like a guy’s got a microphone in.
01:24:59.690 — 01:25:01.450 · Speaker 10
Front of it. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
01:25:01.490 — 01:25:02.610 · Speaker 5
Interviews, people.
01:25:02.650 — 01:25:02.930 · Speaker 10
Sorry.
01:25:02.970 — 01:25:03.770 · Speaker 5
Sorry. Uh, not.
01:25:03.770 — 01:25:07.090 · Speaker 10
He’s not his TV show. TV show. TV show.
01:25:07.130 — 01:25:09.730 · Speaker 6
Not the one with the red couch. No. Flips the. No.
01:25:10.010 — 01:25:12.130 · Speaker 5
The companion podcast, The Grand.
01:25:12.210 — 01:25:13.170 · Speaker 10
Yeah. Okay. I don’t know.
01:25:13.170 — 01:25:13.290 · Speaker 5
What.
01:25:13.290 — 01:25:13.810 · Speaker 10
It’s called.
01:25:13.850 — 01:25:17.370 · Speaker 5
But fantastic. Better than his TV show.
01:25:17.410 — 01:25:17.930 · Speaker 2
Really?
01:25:17.970 — 01:25:27.360 · Speaker 6
So I think. it’s okay. Like you said, he’s a bit stifled by the TV medium. Yeah, I think when he’s got his own podcast, he’s there’s there’s no, no hope.
01:25:27.560 — 01:25:42.040 · Speaker 2
So that’s actually another thing to factor in when deciding on which format to go on, whether it needs to be TV. YouTube TikTok is the kind of content and how far you want to push the envelope.
01:25:42.080 — 01:25:43.040 · Speaker 5
Yeah, and.
01:25:43.200 — 01:25:46.040 · Speaker 2
I mean, is he a brand? So I don’t know his answer.
01:25:46.040 — 01:25:47.760 · Speaker 6
Podcast and branded content.
01:25:47.800 — 01:26:03.000 · Speaker 5
Well, here’s another way to use podcasts with branded content. If you’re a brand that’s sponsoring a big event, doing something big, doing some big out of home, you could create, you can extend that investment. Yes. By talking about it.
01:26:03.040 — 01:26:03.720 · Speaker 2
Yes.
01:26:03.880 — 01:26:07.000 · Speaker 5
So say you’re doing a big concert.
01:26:07.040 — 01:26:08.520 · Speaker 2
The build up to the event.
01:26:08.560 — 01:26:09.800 · Speaker 5
The build up to the event.
01:26:09.840 — 01:26:10.240 · Speaker 2
Yes.
01:26:10.240 — 01:26:11.240 · Speaker 5
Talking with.
01:26:11.280 — 01:26:12.360 · Speaker 6
You. Interview the band.
01:26:12.400 — 01:26:14.480 · Speaker 5
Or talking with the bands. Talking.
01:26:14.520 — 01:26:16.600 · Speaker 2
Yeah. Chatter during the event.
01:26:16.680 — 01:26:23.590 · Speaker 5
All that stuff. So now you can extend your investment into this, whatever you’ve invested into. Yeah. By talking about it more.
01:26:23.630 — 01:26:24.590 · Speaker 2
That’s such a good idea.
01:26:24.630 — 01:26:31.550 · Speaker 5
And sports. If you’ve just slapping your brand on a pair of shorts, why aren’t you talking about it?
01:26:31.590 — 01:26:35.430 · Speaker 6
Or comedians discussing an event over a Savannah or something like that?
01:26:35.470 — 01:26:37.030 · Speaker 2
Yes. Yeah. Yeah.
01:26:37.070 — 01:26:43.230 · Speaker 5
So I think brands are missing a trick with a really cheap medium format.
01:26:43.310 — 01:26:43.870 · Speaker 2
Yeah.
01:26:43.910 — 01:26:58.670 · Speaker 5
Um, but it’s also because there’s a little bit of lack of creativity, to be honest. Yeah. Let’s get creative with this stuff. You can no longer just do one single piece. Also, if we did a podcast, we’re doing reels. We’re doing other.
01:26:58.750 — 01:27:03.270 · Speaker 2
Yes. Well those those are spin offs from that podcast anyway. You’re getting it. Yeah.
01:27:03.310 — 01:27:26.710 · Speaker 5
So podcasts are content generation machines. Yeah. And yes, it’s an investment if you’re doing a long term podcast, but the amount of content you’re getting out of it, the audiences you’re building stores that you can move, then later to other initiatives and use for other campaigns and own the data.
It’s it’s always, you know, right now.
01:27:26.750 — 01:27:28.670 · Speaker 2
Yeah. Okay. Love it.
01:27:29.070 — 01:27:41.510 · Speaker 5
I think what brands need to also hear is if you think a podcast not for you, think again. Chat to someone that’s creative and go. What could we really do with this thing?
01:27:41.550 — 01:27:42.070 · Speaker 2
Yeah.
01:27:42.310 — 01:27:49.270 · Speaker 5
Isn’t this something we could get lots of content for the next five years out of this thing? Um.
01:27:49.590 — 01:28:12.990 · Speaker 2
And how do we make it entertaining? Yeah. Really? I think that’s the core of this, is that the content needs to be entertaining and stand by itself and then valuable. Well, totally. I think the the creating for the sake of creating those days are behind us. People are too discerning now. So it’s got to have its got to have value.
01:28:13.030 — 01:28:15.420 · Speaker 5
We need to abandon the word TV.
01:28:16.260 — 01:28:18.260 · Speaker 2
And the word podcast.
01:28:18.500 — 01:28:22.780 · Speaker 5
Maybe the word podcast, because now we just talk about screens.
01:28:23.460 — 01:28:25.580 · Speaker 6
Or yeah, it’s just entertainment.
01:28:25.620 — 01:28:44.540 · Speaker 5
This isn’t the time. My screen at home can. I can watch podcasts on. I don’t need an iPod player anymore. Yeah, and I think that’s a little confusing for some people, and some people that don’t consume podcasts or think they don’t consume. Podcast podcasts struggled to relate to the term.
01:28:44.580 — 01:28:45.220 · Speaker 2
Yeah.
01:28:45.460 — 01:28:51.300 · Speaker 5
Um, we’re we’re I think it’s an audio radio only thing. It’s really not.
01:28:51.340 — 01:29:08.740 · Speaker 2
No, no. Great. Thank you guys. Love the conversation. Really appreciate it. We would love to hear what your favorite piece of branded entertainment has been. Please leave us in the comments below for us and we’d love to discuss those examples in a future episode.
01:29:08.900 — 01:29:09.740 · Speaker 11
Thank you.
